DRM / Securom

Discussion in 'Gaming Hangout' started by Assassin, Sep 10, 2008.

  1. Assassin

    Assassin Addict

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    Hundreds of people have been giving Spore a one star rating on Amazon, because of the DRM protection: [ame="http://www.amazon.com/review/product/B000FKBCX4/ref=dp_db_cm_cr_acr_txt?_encoding=UTF8&showViewpoints=1"]Amazon.com: Customer Reviews: Spore[/ame]

    What the DRM does is, it counts how many time the game has been installed. After installing the game 3 times, you can't install it anymore. When installing, the game goes online and tells EA an install has been made. If you have installed it 3 times, you apparently can't install it anymore.

    There's also a thing called Securom, which won't let you play a game if you have some programs installed. For example, FEAR will not work if you have DEAMON tools installed:
    [ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j-uulRB1OmY"]YouTube - How anti-piracy screws over people who buy PC games[/ame]

    What do you guys think of these anti-piracy methods? Personally I think they are screwing over people who actually buy the games. You buy it so you can play the game whenever you like. With Spore apparently you can't do this and I wish I had never bought it. I think things like this just make piracy worse and don't improve anything. Why would you buy a game if you can only play install in 3 times? What if something goes wrong during installation? You loose an install? Why would you still buy it? Also with Securom, it's just wrong that anti-piracy want to control what programs you have installed. You have to download a crack to get it to work, which is wrong if you actually bought the game. It's ridiculous. After seeing this, I don't think I will buy a lot of PC games anymore (except for on Steam, which is awesome).
     
  2. Trebor

    Trebor Dolphin Fan

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    When I get home tonight I'm reading the EULA and readme for Spore to see if it mentions anything about how many times I can install it on my PC etc. I downloaded the game through EA download manager and throughout the whole process nothing was mentioned about SecuROM or a minimum of installations. If the DRM was included with the downloadable version I am going to be mad. Hopefully I won't have to format my PC but if I do have to install Spore more than 3 times I hope they'll allow another install. If they say I have to buy the game again I'll boycott their games. I was going to buy a boxed copy of Red Alert 3 but that has minimum installs of 5 and I know for a fact I've installed RA2 more times than that so if downloading it circumvents the DRM I'll buy it, if not it looks like I'll be getting the game through other means instead. I've never actually thought of downloading a game to save time and effort (usually just money) :(.
     
  3. Nimrod

    Nimrod Exotic Vendor

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    I have to be honest, I was on the EA Store this morning thinking of purchasing the Downloadable Spore so I didnt have to wait for the game to come if I ordered it online.

    Then when reading this and other tech sites about the DRM I changed my mind. Guess what? I havent pirated a game in over a year because I believe in honestly supporting makers but I have just pirated Spore.

    I wont be purchasing it either to support Game Devolopers unless they release a DRM-free version in which case I will purchase it just for supporting them.

    Its crazy to think I can be an honest shopper and buy the game and get limits on installing it and some crazy DRM or download it which has the DRM stripped out.

    Whats the point in this DRM? Its not stopping piracy as the warez groups have just removed DRM from the game for pirate users... So honestly only the honest buyers are getting DRM invested software.

    Do yourself a favour, pirate Spore and enjoy it, and take part in the downvoting on Amazon. They have to be taught a lesson or it will keep happening.
     
  4. InsaneNutter

    InsaneNutter Resident Nutter Staff Member

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    I have to agree I wouldn’t knowingly buy any game with DRM in it, I mean what’s the point if I can’t use a game after a few installs? What about people with both laptops and pc’s? I have some games installed on both... with games like spore that would leave me with 1 activation left where as someone who pirated it wouldn’t even have to worry about that.

    DRM only hurts consumers not people who pirate it, most games are cracked before they even go on sale anyway so I’ve always wondered why bother with such extreme forms of copy protection? I understand having to have the CD in the drive to play a game you own, yes that’s annoying but I can live with that... I don’t see how this activation system benefits anyone.

    As it looks like you need an internet connection just to install these games why not just sell them on Steam, that way consumers can install the game on as many PC’s as they want but can only play it when they log in with a Steam account that owns the game.
     
  5. Assassin

    Assassin Addict

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    I have been wondering, since Valve seems to be working with EA more (Left4Dead and apparently they had something to do with the Orange Box as well) what the chances are for EA games going to Steam. Since most EA games come with a key, a lot of games could be easily added to Steam, without having to buy them again over the Steam store.
     
  6. InsaneNutter

    InsaneNutter Resident Nutter Staff Member

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    I would like that to happen a lot but I don’t think it will any time soon, EA have their own online shop called EA Store I would think there more interested in pushing that, however I hope I’m wrong.

    Then again Steam is more than just an online store used by more and more gamers every day. EA might want to get in on the action and get there library of games on there, I think it would benefit both valve, EA and Gamers if that did happen... It would be a perfect solution to the DRM issues and most likely increase sales because of this.

    Edit – Some information on how Securom will be used in Ra3 can be found here

    Even though you can call EA up to authenticate more than 5 times I still wouldn’t be happy about buying a game with copy protection / DRM like this.

    It’s certainly making me think twice about getting Ra 3, especially the bit which sates “EA Customer Service will be on hand to supply any additional authorizations that are warranted” its game over if they decide you’re not warranted to activate a game you have purchased again....
     
  7. Safinn

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    It's good for the makers because know one can do illegal stuff with it. Bu tI like the steam idea. It would work really well.
     
  8. Nimrod

    Nimrod Exotic Vendor

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    Thats hardly true, Ive installed Spore now and following the information in the NFO:

    Code:
      1. Unrar.
      2. Burn or mount the image.
      3. Install the game, when asked for a serial enter one of the following:
      
         SPF7-C9A2-AXYE-4ITI-2RLD
         1KPX-FFAW-CAME-KLSA-2RLD
         HDYG-T4TL-ANIC-7RTS-2RLD
      
      4. Don't install the download manager, don't start without copying over crack
         first, don't register the game with an EA account, and don't go online.
      5. Copy the cracked content over from the Crack directory on the disc to
         your installation directory\SporeBin.
      6. Play the game.
    
    Now I have a copy without the DRM in place which I can install as much as I please and do whatever I want with. And the best bit, I didnt support EA by buying the game.

    I urge everyone to take part in what everyone in the internet is doing about down rating the game for its damaging DRM. If people damage it enough and pirate it as they please they make think about removing the DRM because it isnt serving its point. The game is still cracked and playable by pirates and instead the DRM is just annoying genuine purchasers. Do yourself a favour, save £40 / $60 and pirate the game, its a better copy in the end! :D (But promise yourself if they release a copy without DRM, you will buy it to show your support)
     
  9. Assassin

    Assassin Addict

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    Like Nimrod said, that's not true. It makes piracy worse. People don't want to buy the game if they can only install it a couple of times. It's more like renting than buying a game like that. And why pay for a game you can only play so many times if you can get it for free and play forever? This really backfires on them.
     
  10. Trebor

    Trebor Dolphin Fan

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    I doubt EA will put their games onto Steam seeing as they're trying to push their EA Download software. They're also going to be using their system to release patches for their games, just like Steam does. So far I've had no trouble installing and using their software for purchasing and downloading games such as Spore but if they put their games on Steam I'd be more likely to buy some of their future products. I'm going to download Spore this weekend so that if I can't reactivate my game I have another way of playing it still ;).
     
  11. InsaneNutter

    InsaneNutter Resident Nutter Staff Member

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    That’s what I thought, I don’t know a lot about the EA download manager but I would think they would want to push that. However if EA games were on Steam they would most likely get a lot more downloads than them just been on EA’s system. I would sooner use one content distribution system rather than several different ones.

    However if you buy it from the EA download manager and all you have to do is log in to your account to play the game I think that’s still an improvement over the copy you can buy in the shops.
     
  12. ByteShield

    ByteShield New Member

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    Is Anti-Piracy/DRM the Cure or the Disease for PC Games?

    [FONT=&quot]This is a terrible story for 2 parties - legitimate users who simply wanted to play Spore and couldn't because the activation servers went down and EA because Spore was cracked even before it was released. [/FONT]
    [FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
    [FONT=&quot]Often developers walk a tightrope with the tradeoff between protection strength and the degree of impact on legitimate users but this was a failure on both dimensions! Is this really what the publisher wants to 'accomplish'? Why not use a solution which is friendly to honest users, has no impact on development time and the strongest available protection against crackers - see the whitepaper "Is Anti-Piracy/DRM the Cure or the Disease for PC Games?" which can be downloaded here http://www.byteshield.net/byteshield_whitepaper_0005.pdf[/FONT]
     
  13. Assassin

    Assassin Addict

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    I've just read the whitepaper and it looks promising. I noticed in there you mentioned an example, in which out of 30.000 copies in 2 years, there was only one support question. Assuming by that, Byteshield is already being used. Can you give any names of games or programs which use Byteshield?

    I agree, they would probably try to push their own distributing system before using another, but what of they use multiple systems? I noticed a few days ago that Epic does this. They're selling their games over Steam and also on Impulse. Of course they don't have any distribution program of their own so it's a different situation, but there is a posibility... I'd like to see EA games on Steam. Also Rollercoaster Tycoon, Serious Sam and the Carmageddon games. :P
     
  14. Safinn

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    Just watched the video 3 times and nearly dies of laghter. I know under stad it properly and its a pointless thing.. GET RID of it!
     
  15. Trebor

    Trebor Dolphin Fan

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    HEHE just saw that video as well. I didn't know FEAR had that secuirty software so it should be fun trying to install my retail copy of the game. If I can't I'll just install the pirated version I have. Yes you heard that right, I downloaded a game, liked it enough and got it. If I'm gonna have continual problems with games like that poor guy in that very funny video, it looks like I'll be sailing the high seas and drinking rum yarrrr!
     
  16. Cpp

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    TBH, I've hated SecuROM since its birth and I've even attempted to crack it myself a couple of times tho without much success. All I can say from scanning and disassembling the code is that it's all just one big waste of disk space. While I don't game as much as I used to in the past, I normally bought the games that I liked (counted over 40 originals). However, most of this has changed in recent years due to these so-called copy protections. The biggest factor is that I dislike how these systems operate. I've been reading articles with some evidence that certain copy protections take your PC hardware configuration, steal the hardware serial numbers, send those back to the internet, poke through your OS's memory, install rootkits and require admin access to do god knows what else. This is precisely the kind of behavior that I will not tolerate on my PC's regardless of what the EULA says.
     
  17. InsaneNutter

    InsaneNutter Resident Nutter Staff Member

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    Copy protection also breaks games in new operating systems too, for example I own Worms 4 Mayhem on PC which uses Starforce for its copy protection.

    When installing the game on Vista it simply won’t work because the version of Starforce it uses is not compatible with Vista or 64bit operating systems. But once I go to a dodgy website and download a no-cd crack the game loads up and works perfectly :O

    Another example of pirates having the advantage over people who actually purchased the game.
     
  18. Assassin

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    'Ironically, due to the fans' backlash, Spore's DRM has made it one of the most pirated games in history, with an estimated 500,000 illegal downloads as of September 14, 2008.'

    I can't help but feel sorry for Will Wright. He devoted seven years of his life to this game and it ends up being massively downloaded because EA needs it's DRM.
     
  19. InsaneNutter

    InsaneNutter Resident Nutter Staff Member

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    Was it just one guy who created the entire game?

    I really hope this does make EA look at the current DRM situation and have a re think.
     
  20. Assassin

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    I'm not sure actually but he does seem to be the creative mind behind Maxis, as he also created Sim City, The Sims, etc. From what I've heard EA decided to loosen the DRM on Red Alert 3 from 3 to 5 installs. This to me seems like they really don't get the point. You dont make people happy by adding 2 extra installs, they bought the game and want to install it whenever they like. I bet RA3 will get massively downloaded again. EA is doing it to itself.
     

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